LAZ wrote:I was recently told that you can make bland matzos taste better by toasting them in the oven. I don't think this is necessary with Yehuda, my favorite brand, but this year I was given several boxes of Manischewitz, which I thought were pretty blah, and I intend to try it.

I agree that Yehuda is the best brand. I'll be interested to see if you can improve Manischewitz.

My wife and I don't keep kosher for Passover, but my Mom managed to stick a box of matzoh into our bag of leftovers after our seder on Friday night... I'm thinking of trying to put in food processor to make a fine matzoh meal, and then make "flour" tortillas out of it... I also want to discuss with a rabbi why tortillas can't be kosher for passover from the get-go, given that the ingredients are the same as matzoh, with just the addition of shortening.

blipsman wrote:I also want to discuss with a rabbi why tortillas can't be kosher for passover from the get-go, given that the ingredients are the same as matzoh, with just the addition of shortening.

One perspective - http://judaism.about.com/od/passove1/f/ ... rtilla.htm

Dave148 wrote:

blipsman wrote:I also want to discuss with a rabbi why tortillas can't be kosher for passover from the get-go, given that the ingredients are the same as matzoh, with just the addition of shortening.

One perspective - http://judaism.about.com/od/passove1/f/ ... rtilla.htm

He just addressed corn tortillas, which is the coward's way out.

The better answer is that matzah as defined by orthodox Judaism as flour that is mixed with water and baked to completion within an 18 minute window (from the moment that water is added to removal from the oven). Someone, somewhere in the pre-Harold McGee era decided that flour's natural tendency to self-leaven (tot he extent that such a thing is possible) is arrested if the process is completed in the 18 minute time frame.

So that's limitation number one. A tortilla would have to be similarly prepared.

Limitation two is that the introduction of shortening, even Kosher-and-Passover-certified shortening, renders the matzoh ritually invalid. Passover matzoh is flour and water. Egg matzoh, as an example, is not permitted for ritual use and is not permitted in many orthodox homes during Passover. The lone exception being for the "infirm" and/or elderly. Here's a little more detail:

http://www.oukosher.org/index.php/passo ... le/1377941

I did talk to a kosher caterer who had had kosher-for-Passover tortillas made in Israel. So they exist. I'm not sure what they're made of, though. Not flour.

Basically, you aren't allowed to make anything from flour for Passover except matzo. And matzo must be made from wheat, rye, spelt, barley or oats. (Some companies make gluten-free matzo from potato or tapioca starch, but they're labeled something like "matzo-style crackers," and you can't use them for Seder. There are gluten-free oat matzos that are OK for Seder, but I'm told they don't taste as good.)

Going back to my youth, the only things I do are put sweet butter on and eat for a snack, or put cheese and melt it in the microwave (you have to drain the oil).
My son also does lox on top of sweet butter as a snack.

Things not to do with matzo: Do not eat matzo over your keyboard!

I used to eat ham on matzo all the time when I was a kid.

Mmmmm...sacrilicious.

Even worse would be ham 'n cheese on matzo!

LAZ--would *corn* tortillas be kosher?

Geo

Geo wrote:Even worse would be ham 'n cheese on matzo!

LAZ--would *corn* tortillas be kosher?

Geo

This was already touched upon but Eastern European (Ashkenazi) Jews prohibit the use of "kiniyot" which is an expansion of the prohibited grains to include legumes, corn, rice and other things from which a "flour" could be created. Sephardic (Spanish/Mediterranean) Jews have no such prohibition and can use corn or corn products.

That's interesting spiny, tnx. I guess that would rule out potato flour too, eh? Be tough on latkes, tho'!!

Geo

Geo wrote:That's interesting spiny, tnx. I guess that would rule out potato flour too, eh? Be tough on latkes, tho'!!

Geo

Actually, no. The prohibition is not on things that can be called "flour" (potato "flour" isn't really a flour), the prohibition is on the grains, seeds, legumes (peas, garbanzos, beans of all kinds) themselves. Adding further confusion, you can take matzoh and grind it and then use that "flour" to add body to baked goods (the idea being that its leavening powers have been arrested during the initial baking step - although others won't use it if it's re-purposed in this manner, which is sometimes referred to as "gebrokts"). So vegetables that are acceptable for Passover use are acceptable in any form.

The origins of these prohibitions were that certain prohibited foods had an ability to "bloom" or leaven in flour form and thus were considered to be in violation of the prohibition against using leavening agents or leavened products. It went a bit far afield in that seeds like cumin and mustard are prohibited but quinoa is somewhat accepted (this takes us down a different path to foodstuffs that were not within the contemplation of the authorities of the day "way back when" - i.e. no Jes in South America until fairly recently so when stuff when on the bad list, quinoa couldn't be included).

The rules are, to be polite, somewhat arbitrary. For example, 30-40 years ago, the prevalent Passover oil in stores was peanut oil, this was acceptable even though peanuts were not. The current rules eliminate peanut oil entirely.

There are literally volumes of text on the "how" and "what" of Passover observance (with very little "why?" offered in explanation - but that's why they call it "faith.")

My recent piece for the Sun-Times (Don't pass these over) spells out the differences between three categories of prohibited foods: Chometz (banned for all Jews), kitniyot (banned for Ashkenazim) and gebrokts (banned for a small group, mostly Hasids).

There is a lot of confusion about what is and what isn't allowed, even among religious Jews. Complicating this, there are further restrictions and leniencies in different communities. Each Jew is supposed to follow the dictates of his or her own family tradition and rabbinical advice. I was startled to learn that Italian Jews avoid dairy products and chocolate during Passover, according to Edda Servi Machlin. Ethiopian Jews don't eat their beloved teff, but make matzo from chickpeas (not permitted for Ashkenazim).

And the rules about kitniyot have been challenged in Israel, so some Israeli Ashkenazim do eat them now. (There are a bunch of things are different in Israel than in the Diaspora, including what parts of animals are kosher and how long holidays are observed.)

LAZ wrote:My recent piece for the Sun-Times (Don't pass these over) spells out the differences between three categories of prohibited foods: Chometz (banned for all Jews), kitniyot (banned for Ashkenazim) and gebrokts (banned for a small group, mostly Hasids).

There is a lot of confusion about what is and what isn't allowed, even among religious Jews. Complicating this, there are further restrictions and leniencies in different communities. Each Jew is supposed to follow the dictates of his or her own family tradition and rabbinical advice. I was startled to learn that Italian Jews avoid dairy products and chocolate during Passover, according to Edda Servi Machlin. Ethiopian Jews don't eat their beloved teff, but make matzo from chickpeas (not permitted for Ashkenazim).

And the rules about kitniyot have been challenged in Israel, so some Israeli Ashkenazim do eat them now. (There are a bunch of things are different in Israel than in the Diaspora, including what parts of animals are kosher and how long holidays are observed.)

The rules get even more varied than above. For example, when an Ashkenazi woman marries a Sephardic man she typically takes on his customs, so you can "switch" sides. Also, the gebrokts restriction is more far-reaching than just Hasidic groups. I remember getting my head handed to me on a Seder plate when, as a guest of my mother's aunt & uncle (Orthodox, but not Hasidic) I broke up a matzoh into my bowl of soup. My mom swore up and down that they never had such restrictions in prior years, but people easily fall into a Jewier-than-thou mindset.

LAZ wrote: (There are a bunch of things are different in Israel than in the Diaspora, including what parts of animals are kosher and how long holidays are observed.)

Just one correction the laws of what parts of the animal are kosher are the same both in Israel and the Diaspora - the rear portion of the animal is kosher as long as the sciatic nerve is removed as part of the butchering process - in the US it is too time consuming to do with the amount of meat that is processed - it quicker and more cost effective to cut the animal in half and sell the rear portion to a non-kosher processing plant while in Israel they do not process as much kosher meat and can take the time to remove the nerve allowing the rear portion of the animal to be used - so you can get a kosher tenderloin in Israel -

The Amazing Matzo Stimulus - http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/15/magaz ... .html?_r=1

‘Man, Oh Manischewitz’: Kosher Food Merger Opens New Chapter for Famous Name

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/02/busi ... -ios-share

Thank you for posting this Dave, appreciate it!
I think consolidation is to be expected in any niche.
I wonder if eventually the name will disappear since the article seems to indicate “the old-time Manischewitz customer has passed on.”

Fried matzo with onions = breakfast. #socialdistancingcooking



Fried matzo, count me a Fan!

A favorite when I'm at my Mom's - Fried Matzah. I can make it as well, but I seldom have matzah in my pantry while she always does. My Dad liked salami added to it. I can't have it now because I'm doing low carb. As others have said she also says Yehuda is the best.

That looks great, Gary!
We made matzo using a recent recipe in the New York Times. Apparently, it's not actually kosher for passover, but it was the best matzo I ever had that was not covered in toffee/chocolate (yes, very low bar).

Handmade matzo is by far the best option out there, but runs $15-$20+ per pound. The better examples taste like a well-made Neapolitan pizza crust (albeit flat/crispy) and brings out the nuttiness of the wheat. We buy a box every year for the seders.